The Silent Why: finding hope in grief and loss

Loss 39/101: Loss of riding a motorbike: Mark Riddles

December 13, 2022 Chris Sandys, Claire Sandys, Mark Riddles Episode 58
The Silent Why: finding hope in grief and loss
Loss 39/101: Loss of riding a motorbike: Mark Riddles
Show Notes Transcript

#058. How do you grieve a loss that others might be happy about?

This is The Silent Why, a podcast on a mission to open up conversations around loss and grief and to see if hope can be found in 101 different types of loss.

Loss #39 of 101 - Loss of riding a motorbike

Meet Mark Riddles, from Northern Ireland, who was hit by a car while out riding his motorbike in 2021. Despite only going 30-40mph the collision was enough to end Mark’s motorbiking days, a passion he’d had for as long as he could remember. 

Mark had two (very nice!) motorbikes and loved everything about the biking life. However, like many family members of bikers, not everyone was as encouraging of his potentially dangerous hobby, so when he had to give it up it wasn’t just sympathy he got but also a bit of ‘I told you so’. 

This episode opens a fascinating conversation about how sympathetic we are to other people's losses if we can't understand the love for what they lost. How we might put our own spin on their loss because of our opinion of what happened. An important example of how all losses contain grief.

In this episode Mark talks openly about his experience of losing something he loved, how he might have responded differently if he didn’t have a family, why he hadn’t really thought of it as a loss to grieve before, and what he wants others to know in similar situations. 

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Thank you for listening.

Mark:

Hey, I'm Mark Riddles. I'm here to talk about my loss of riding a motorbike following a crash, which happened last year.

Claire :

Welcome The Silent Why, a podcast with a mission to find 101 different types of loss and to hear from those who have experienced them. This is lost 39. I'm Claire Sandys.

Chris:

And I'm her husband, Chris. And in this episode we're talking about a subject that we've enjoyed a lot over the years, motorbikes.

Claire :

And it's not just the bikes we love. It's also the accent!

Chris:

Mark actually asked us after our chat, if we think he sounds Irish, we were like,'yes, it's so good!' Just like occasionally we have American guests saying that our English accents.

Claire :

Mark lives in Northern Ireland and has loved bikes for as long as he can remember.

Mark:

My head was literally always thinking about bikes all the time. I don't know if it was an unhealthy addiction, but I just loved bikes all the time. YouTube motorbikes, motorbikes. It was, it was crazy.

Chris:

Mark was, and still is, a huge bike enthusiast. In fact, he had two of them. But he made a big decision to sell both after a nasty accident at relatively low speed.

Claire :

As they say, 'A bike on the road, is worth two in the shed.'

Mark:

I was just going 30-35 miles an hour, as I said, she just suddenly pulled out and hit me. The right side of my bike sorta hit her. I kind of saw her. And when she hit me, I was like, 'no, no, no' that's all I remember shouting in my helmet.

Chris:

If you've not experienced being on a motorbike, it's worth noting the level of enjoyment in riding and the huge community that's built around it, as they also say, 'Four wheels move the body, two wheels move the soul.'

Mark:

It's just freedom. In a car, you're kind of in a box. But on a bike, you're open to everything. And it's a lot more body focused, you know, everything you do has an effect to the bike.

Claire :

We're keen to represent all kinds of loss on this podcast. And in this chat, we uncovered some fascinating aspects of a permanent loss that was partly chosen, but also one that most people were pleased about, which adds a new dimension to grieving it.

Chris:

Yeah. How do you process the loss of something you love that other people are glad is gone? Or wanted you to lose? How do you support someone through a loss that you're relieved about?

Claire :

We hope this chat will help people be more considerate of losses that might be hard to comprehend if we don't understand them, but ultimately still involve someone's personal grief

Mark:

Apart from you guys I've never really been asked 'is it like a loss or anything?' It's kind of just like, you know,'well, don't do it again, because it's dangerous, you might kill yourself next time'.

Chris:

So let's get going. Mark started off by telling us a bit about himself.

Mark:

Yep, I'm Mark Riddles. I'm 31 years old. I live in Bangor, Northern Ireland. I have two kids and a wife. I work in a care home five days a week. I am a chef in a care home. So I look after about 34 residents, to supply them with meals and just help in general, every day, help with them really in food areas really. My work is only about 10 minutes down the road, so everything is close to me is, you know, ideal. My family is close to me. My wife's family is close to me. So everything's kind of, you know, close.

Chris:

I'm imagining being a chef outside of a care home, you get lots of praise, lots of criticism. Do you get lots of praise and criticism for being a chef inside a care home?

Mark:

It's ,yeah, I would say sometimes from the staff, you know, they're kind of like, 'oh, you should make this better'. Or the residents are like, 'Oh, that's a really, really good, we really enjoy that' which I get a good kick out of that. I just like helping the older generation because they have so much experience and they've lived through so much more than we have, so.

Chris:

Yeah, for sure. So, I mean, this is going to be a really interesting chat for us because it's a bit different. I'm really excited to speak to you because we share an interest of something in particular. So tell us a little bit about the the hobby or the transport that you have loved up until recently.

Mark:

So I started loving bikes, motorbikes. Probably when I was about 16. So I got a wee 50cc Supermoto, and I drove it to tech every day. And then I after that, I got an off-road dirt bike, so I ended up doing a bit of off roading. And then after that, I got a mini moto like the the miniature sized motorbikes, which are like a lawnmower engine. And then after that, I got a car licence, which took me away from bikes for many, many years. And then all down to my brother in law, who is a mod biker, he's he's fanatical about motorbikes. He got me back into bikes. And he was he was kind of like, your motorbike licence is so easy to get to. I was like,'Oh, how do you get it?' and he told me the whole rigmarole he had to go through, and I was like, 'I'm gonna do that'. So I went and got my proper motorbike licence. And yeah, I just love being on the bikes. And I used to have a Bandit 650. And then I went up to just went up to the top range, pretty much so I went up to a Fireblade, and then I had Kawasaki Z900. So yeah, I had two pretty fast bikes.

Chris:

Envious.

Claire :

Nice. I think I've sat on one of them at the MotoGP where they've got them on stands, and you can just jump on and just I think I've been on the Fireblade a couple of times.

Mark:

So I blame my brother in law for the love of bikes.

Chris:

Well, it's quite an interesting progression because you sort of started small, 50cc, then went off road then went to a Mini Moto and then up so it's sort of been a bit all over the place.

Mark:

Yeah, yeah yeah, it definitely has,

Chris:

Obviously with the experience of off road biking, but then then getting into it properly on the road with with some quite, you know fast bikes. What were some of the things you enjoyed the most about being out on the road on a bike sun shining whatever else?

Mark:

Going out clearing the head, just you in the road pretty much. I always loved going out with other people as well, it was kinda like, it's just good fun to go out with friends and have the same interest. And, you know, when you stop for a coffee or something, you can all just talk about bikes. I just love being surrounded by people just talking about bikes all day, every day, you know, I could do it. I was I had such a love for it. Meeting new people as well, it was such a such a blessing to go and see new people and have the same interests and give my knowledge of bikes to them and vice versa. So I just loved that.

Claire :

We didn't do a lot of the community side of it. But I do remember meeting a few people. And like you said, when you've got that interest in common, it's amazing how quickly you connect. And I loved how they were all interested in each other's bikes, so people always wandering around other people's bikes to have a look at them, and...

Mark:

Yeah, I love that. Yeah, I absolutely love that.

Chris:

Was this something your wife shared is like a bit of a hobby or interest, was she supportive of it?

Mark:

Errmmm. No, she hated them from day one. She absolutely hates him. She always respected me. And you know, 'you go and do your man time and go and do your own thing' sort of thing. But obviously, when the accident happened, she was kinda like, you know, maybe you should lay off the motorbikes. And she never really liked them. But obviously, when the accident happened, she really disliked them then. So that was a big sort of part to play on it as well I suppose, but no, she never got on the back or anything.

Chris:

Because for me, my experience I got into biking off road growing up, we had a farm, seven of us cousins, old boys all similar age with grandparents farm, had a little car, a couple of bikes, loved it. And then got into riding on the road only when I was like late 20s, I think. So because I was that age, I went quite sort of straight in learning, passing a test within four days, quite intensive course and up to a 500cc and then up to 1000cc after that. But it was something that Claire always loved as well. So the two of us without having children, it became not just riding but watching on the telly as well. We'd watch the MotoGP would go to our sort of Silverstone racetrack in England. We just love being part of that world. You know, we dreamt at times of actually working in the MotoGP world and travelling the world thinking well, why not, we haven't got kids? It was lovely for the pair of us to share that even though Claire has never wanted to ride, have you?

Claire :

No I was quite happy on the back really. The occasional time with a lot of bikes together. It was always nice if a female turned up.

Mark:

Yeah.

Claire :

Or there was another pillion there, because otherwise, I was in the minority. I knew more women like your wife. Who just didn't even like the idea that I would let you go out on one because of the... you know, it's seen as so dangerous, isn't it? So I think is something that people have got kind of a caution mark over.

Mark:

Yeah, especially on the roads today. I think there's a lot more cars than there used to be. Like, if I ever go for a ride for what, two hours, three hours, you're exhausted at the end of it because you're so concentrating all the time on other people. As my granddad used to say, you know, 'drive like everyone else was a maniac', you know what I mean? So you just have to be on the ball all the time and have a car you can kind of relax, stick on cruise control on the highway, whatever. On the bike, it's, you know, the winds hit you and yeah, it's just it's concentration that the highest degree at all times.

Claire :

Yeah, I think it's worse watching it as well. I remember being on it on a motorway and not thinking a lot about it apart from how fast it felt. But then I remember driving home behind you once on the bike, and I really did not like watching you on it. It was weird that it's a different sort of feeling if you haven't been on one yourself. I think I can see why people get nervous about that.

Chris:

Not that I want to set up the accident or anything or cast any aspersions, but because the bikes you rode were quite you know, crouched over sports bikes, you know, you cut through the air, you can't feel the speed, what's the fastest you've been on one of your bikes?

Mark:

Err, the Fireblade - about 150mph.

Chris:

Oh my word, did it feel like you were doing 150?

Mark:

It did. It was fast because I overtook a friend and they left him like, and he was going pretty fast. But I kind of looked at the speedo and I saw 150mph and the revs were only like 9000 revs. So the bike could have went way quicker. I was like, you know, the back of my mind the kids always come back to my mind. It's always the kids the kids you know 'if something happens to me...what about the kids?' 'what about the kids and my wife and stuff?' You know, if I had a stone at that speed - I'm a goner, you know, it was always in the back of my mind, you know, I love the speed but only for a short time.

Claire :

I remember them saying about the MotoGP riders sometimes that the minute they have children quite a lot of them drop off from being competitive because there's something mentally that just stops you at that point from pushing it to the very edge.

Mark:

Yeah, 100%.

Claire :

What was the worst bit about riding it? What's the bad side of biking?

Mark:

When you get wet! [laughs] The wet roads, the white markings. See I use mine every day. I didn't have a car. So I had two motorbikes and my wife had the car so she obviously needed a car with the kids. So I was using the bike pretty much in every weather, which I kind of regret now, because, you know, going back to the accident again, you know if I was in a car when the happened blah blah blah, but yeah, I think I used the bike too much. I was too fixated on the bike and my head was literally always thinking about bikes all the time. I don't know if it was an unhealthy addiction, but I just loved bikes all the time. YouTube motorbikes, motorbikes. It was, it was crazy.

Chris:

YouTube has certainly opened up a world of watching other people's misfortune on motorbikes.

Mark:

Yes, definitely.

Chris:

My brother was into motorbikes as well and he had a really lovely Triumph. This is not an uncommon story, but he had just put new tyres on it. Now those that have never riden a motorbike won't know how perilous it is, when you've put new tyres on a motorbike and they have that sort of waxy sheen. You've got to scrub the tires and you've got to ride it in before you get grip. And I think he literally and there are YouTube videos of people doing the same thing. He turned one corner leaving the bike garage where he'd had two new tyres put on and dropped it and it just went straight down, the wheels slipped out.

Claire :

I think he walked it just straight back in, didn't he?

Chris:

He walked it straight back and sold it to them. I think he pretty much wrote if off.

Mark:

Wow. That's what the guy said to me. I got new tyres on the Firebird. Yeah, he was like'don't pull the throttle too hard or don't go round the corner too quick' or whatever. So I was going very slow on the way home.

Chris:

Just describe for, again, for those that haven't ever ridden a motorbike, describe the feelings what you do, the sensations, what is it like actually being aboard a motorbike?

Mark:

It's just freedom. In a car, you're kind of in a box. But on a bike, you're open to everything. And it's a lot more body focused, you know, everything you do has an effect to the bike. So as I said before, your concentration levels are so high. Obviously the speed and you know overtaking someone you kind of feel you're in the MotoGp sort of thing, but just the freedom, I think not having a metal box around you. So that's what I loved about it.

Claire :

So tell us a bit about what led up to you having to give this up then what actually happened on that day.

Mark:

Yeah, so the day, I was just going to see my mother and father. They live about 10 minutes from my house. Just going down the road, there was roadworks previous to where I was coming up to and just going down the road 30-35 miles an hour. There was a woman in the central turning point or whatever, to the petrol station, and I saw her she was sitting. I was just going 30-35 miles an hour, as I said, she just suddenly pulled out and hit me. The right side of my bike sort of hit her. I kind of saw her and when she hit me, I was like,'no, no, no', that's all I remember shouting in my helmet. And once she hit me, it did the 360 spin flew down the road. The bike went down the road. And I went flying into a lamppost. My ankle hit the lamppost. The bike was off the road down somewhere. So once that happened, I was lying there. She got out of the car, she jumped over ran over to me, and was like, 'Oh, I didn't see you. I didn't see you. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry'. And then since it was right outside of petrol station, there was a lot of people witnessed it. So there was a builder who jumped out of his van and he ran over to me, I think it was a painter. He had loads of like, you know, sheets, big painting sheets when you put over like the houses when you're painting them. So he covered me and sheets because it was freezing at this point. You know, the shock, your body just goes into complete shock. You're like, 'what on earth just happened?' And I was yeah, literally just lying there and then lay there for 15-20 minutes, maybe 25 minutes. And then the police showed up. They kind of cleared the road. And then the ambulance showed up. And then I saw a helicopter flyover and I was like 'there's no way that's for me', and it landed in behind the petrol station. And yeah, the air ambulance was there for me too. And I was like, 'Oh, what have I done? What if I broke? What have I...?' you know, the adrenaline and all was going, and I was in shock. So it didn't feel any pain, really. So I was just laying there in disbelief, thinking, you know, could I have done something to avoid this? You always think to yourself, it's never gonna happen to you. And when it does, you're like, what? Yeah, complete disbelief. Just crazy.

Claire :

What were the kind of emotions you were going through as you started to sort of come around and realise what had happened?

Mark:

Yeah, I kind of thought will I be able to walk? Well, I'll be able to I don't know see, I didn't know what I broken. I hadn't a clue. I just it was complete shock. I didn't know Yeah, I was just in disbelief. One of the thoughts come into my head was 'what about work tomorrow?' you know what I mean? Because I was off a day and then I was supposed to be back to work I think the next day so I was like, 'do I have to use annual leave for this?' or what do I do.

Chris:

Think we've had that a few times, haven't we?

Claire :

Yeah.

Chris:

You know, in those moments of shock some strange thoughts about stuff that's quite insignificant. Yeah, comes comes to mind.

Claire :

Quite practical things. So what were your injuries? What had happened?

Mark:

I broke my ankle. Broke my hand. So I kind of hit the dirt and then my helmet flew off down the road. So I had a big cut up the side of my face as well. I think it protected the, you know, the first sort of crash. But afterwards it flew off because maybe I was rolling or something, but it's hard to remember. So yeah, cuts and bruises everywhere pretty much.

Chris:

When you said you were only literally going 10-15 minutes away to visit your parents. The tricky thing is, and I found this when I was riding as well that when you are doing something that's quite short, you tend to think it's not as important to put all my gear on. So were you fully decked up in your safety stuff, or not?

Mark:

I was. I kind of had my all weather gear on. I had like a full racing suit, which I wasn't wearing that day. Plus, I kind of had shoes on that didn't protect the ankle really well. So if I had proper boots on I might have saved my ankle, I'm not, you know, who knows? But yeah, I probably could have been worn slightly better gear, I suppose. A better helmet as well, because I was kind of wearing my old helmet, which didn't fit overly. It had a good fit, but my other helmet was like a lot tighter. So it would have been a lot better but sure you only think you're going 10-15 minutes down the road, nothing's gonna happen.

Chris:

Nothing's gonna happen. Yeah, well, helmets shouldn't fly off.

Mark:

No, they shouldn't, no I know.

Chris:

Did the strap break?

Mark:

Yes. I think it did at the time yeah, I think it kind of rippped out sort of thing, so.

Chris:

So you know, you mentioned the love of riding is all about freedom. So one minute, you've got the freedom, the joy, the next minute, you've got loads of people around you saying 'don't move! you alright? Can you hear me?' all that sort of stuff. Yeah. A very different experience. Can you remember how long it was before you felt pain before the shock wore off? And you started to feel the discomfort or the pain?

Mark:

Yes. I think when the air ambulance landed, the guys came over. He was like a high flying doctor, I don't know if he was a surgeon, whatever, paramedic person. So he came over and he was asking me 'Do you have any other you know, like things wrong with you?' So I'm type one diabetic. So I'm insulin dependant. So yeah, I was kind of like, 'oh, no, if my bloods are low, it's going to be my fault'. So that was that was in the back of my head as well. I was like thinking, 'I'm gonna get the blame for this'. But they checked my bloods, and they were 5.4, so there were fine, there was nothing to do with me. So that was I was to get out of jail card sort of thing. Once they sorted me out, I took my bloods they cut all the gear off me. Took a scissors to everything. So I was literally, like, literally in my tracksuit bottoms at the end of it, they just cut every single bit off me because they didn't want to move me because they don't know what I had broken and so on. And then I started to feel the pain once they put me in the back of the ambulance when I kind of calm down. And then the ambulance driver was like 'what's sore?' And I was like 'my hand and my ankle'. So yeah, that's when the pain sort of started to hit me then.

Claire :

How long were you in hospital for?

Mark:

I was there overnight. And then I got out the next late late evening, well late evening as in seven, eight o'clock. And then I was at home for two days. And then they called me back in again, because they wanted to do surgery on me on my ankle. So they called me back in and as being a diabetic, if anything bad happens to you, your bloods are all over the place. You can't control your blood, and they look for that when you're in hospital, they look for, you know, they're not going to perform surgery on the diabetic who has bad bloods, you know, like up and down. And so they kind of looked at my bloods, and they were like, yeah, you're not suitable for a surgery. So they kept me overnight to see if I would, if my bloods would settle and they didn't. So they sent me home again. And then three days later, they brought me in again. So yeah, it was a lot of to-ing and fro-ing. And then they finally done surgery on me.

Claire :

So I'm guessing at this point, the last thing on your mind is getting back on a bike because you're trying to heal and get better and stuff. So at what point did you start thinking about whether that would happen or might not happen?

Mark:

Yeah, I think the first night I was in, like, the Accident and Emergency bit, sort of lying there thinking 'Yeah', it's just, I don't know, a real sense of 'don't do this again', sort of thing. You know, I was praying about it and thinking,'you know, God was it me? Was it my fault? Did I do something stupid?', but I kind of got a peace thinking, you know, it wasn't my fault, which was, which was really beneficial. Just got a real sense of, you know, there's more to life than this, that just kept on coming over me, you know, so, and as I've said, previous, I'm a big gamer, so I was kind of 'drop one hobby, go to another'[laughs]. That's what, yeah. I kind of I think guys have to have hobbies, so I kinda went from one hobby to another.

Claire :

How did it feel knowing that this might be something that you would never do again?

Mark:

Yeah, I felt bad because, you know, I have such a love for motorbikes and stuff. I was always have from young age and yeah, it was kind of like all the knowledge and all the magazines have bought and all the gear and sure I had another bike sitting there brand new, pretty much, just sitting there, ready to go. And it was kind of like 'man this really sucks'. But I had to think of my family and you just have to keep thinking about my family and stuff, so.

Chris:

In terms of the surgery that you've had, because you've got a metal plate now in one of your ankles, is that right?

Mark:

Yeah, four screws as well.

Chris:

Is that they're there forever?

Mark:

Yeah, that's for forever. Yeah. Unless it gives me bothered down the line, the surgeon said that's gonna be there forever.

Chris:

Do they impact you, or have they stopped you doing anything aside for the motorbiking?

Mark:

Yeah, well, we have a big trampoline at the back of our house, which I can't go on with the kids now. I can't bounce, like, you know, with the kids. And a lot of things, you know. I still go running, which is still pretty good. I'm pleased I can still do that. But I can't walk for long periods because my ankle is still swollen to this day after the accident. So I don't know if that swelling will ever go away. And the doctor said about arthritis, maybe down the line, God forbid that happens, but, yeah, I'm very cautious with the ankle, you know, when the kids are running and jumping and stuff, you know, they're always like, 'Oh, Daddy, sorry about the ankle', and have a massive scar there too. So it's, yeah, it's very noticeable. And yeah, I can't do everything that I used to do. I was very active. And, you know, if you'd like jump over a wall or something, you know, playing football or, you know, tackling playing football with friends and stuff, I'm a lot more cautious now.

Chris:

It sounds like you need to join the early 40's club that I mean, you don't jump over walls, you slowly climb over them at my age, I left that behind.

Claire :

It's funny, it just it hits me that you know, part of why we're wanting to do the podcast was to show all the different kinds of losses, but not just how one loss might be to somebody, but how it depends on your situation as to how big that loss impacts you. And like you said, you get to spend more time with your family, you get to drive around in the car, you get to do these other things. But then if you'd have been a single guy, maybe, and you could have got straight back on the bike, then you probably would have done because that might have been a massive chunk of your life. So that loss would have been possibly even bigger, because there's nothing to fill that gap with. But it strikes me that people would have more sympathy with the trampoline situation than losing your bike because that involves family and children and not being able to engage with them, and yet, the loss of that in your life, overall will be significantly smaller than the bike bit. But because the bikes are dangerous, it's not necessarily seen in the same way, which is is sad, really. But I feel like I'm glad there are people like you out there because I know that if you come across someone else who can't ride a bike, that might be a conversation where you really can understand and empathise with that person.

Mark:

Yeah.

Claire :

And help them in a way that no one else really can., because a lot of people just don't understand it. Is that something that you think you'd take a lot of enjoyment in in some way that you might be able to help someone else, where it might be a bigger loss for them?

Mark:

Yeah. 100% yeah, I work in a care home. So anyway, I can help people and I'm always there kind of a helping person, you know, in any way I can. If I can help people with, if that ever happened to anyone else, I'd be 100% up for helping people. Yeah, definitely. I like to share life experiences with people. So that's what life's about, you have to learn from each other. So yeah.

Chris:

So in terms of not continuing motorbiking, is that something that you've chosen to do? Or that you're sort of, there's no way it could happen. Could you ride again?

Mark:

Strictly speaking, I could ride again. Yeah, I don't know, obviously, with the clutch, with my, you know, going up the gears and turning the gears with my left foot might be a bit of an issue. I haven't obviously tried since I've had the accident, but it's the whole you know, how would I react to it? You know what, I'd be overly cautious and do something stupid? Or because just me driving a car now I'm a lot more cautious. When I was on the bike I was quite a fast rider and now I'm not, so yeah, it's kind of zonked my confidence.

Chris:

been like it at at 50mph, 90mph, 110mph?

Mark:

Oh yeah, yeah.

Chris:

Not so much coming off the bike. But when you hit something like a lamppost. Yeah, quite often, you'll hear that that's that can cause even more damage than falling off the bike getting hit in the first place. And obviously your ankle got the full brunt of hitting the lamppost. Other than being asked to join us on this podcast? Have you considered it as being a loss or something that you have lost and therefore must be grieved? Has it ever been considered in that sort of way?

Mark:

No one's really asked me that before, apart from you guys, but it's kind of in my family. Obviously, my brother in law was kind of like you're gonna get on the bike again, you know, my sister had just passed her test, and she was kind of wanting to go and ride with me too. But that was obviously brought to an abrupt end. But yeah, apart from you guys, I've never really been asked is it like a loss or anything? It's kind of just like, you know, we'll don't do it again, because it's dangerous, you might kill yourself next time. I haven't really thought of it as a loss loss.

Chris:

And that's, that's a really hard thing, something that we were talking about as we were sort of chatting and preparing for a meeting with you that it adds another dimension, a complex dimension to a loss when you know that people around you are may be pleased that you have that loss. As opposed to joining you and saying we're sorry about that, that's quite tough. You know, because there's such a deep love and a passion and enjoyment of it to lose that as a hobby, as a mode of transport taps into into all the emotions, but to have people around you saying 'good!' You know, isn't isn't helpful in that regard. So yeah, I feel for you in that, in that sense.

Claire :

And no amount of, you know, we would talk about like, Yeah. all change being loss, which is something new that we've come across with the podcast, and I think I've never thought of it like that before. But what I'm starting to realise more and more that if you love something, and you enjoy it, and it's taken away, it's a loss and that loss will be grieved to a certain degree, obviously, it varies depending on whether it's a person or thing or hobby. Have you found times when it's been harder than you thought, where it might not have been the decision, but actually, when the weather got better, it suddenly felt harder at that point? Has there any points then that you thought, actually, this is trickier than I thought?

Mark:

Yeah, over the summer, obviously, I live in Northern Ireland, it's a big biking country, you know, lot of people are into their bikes. So it's kind of when I had the bike, I would go out with friends and went down to Newcastle and just hit the whole, you know, lap sort of thing with my friends and stuff. And I, I kind of go out with my family, which I should have been doing anyway. But I obviously do that a lot more now, but it's kind of, you know, go down the back roads and the motorbikes over taking, thinking, 'oh, man, that could have been me', you know, I kind of want to do that again. But yeah, it gets you sometimes, you know, my wife kind of looks at me and says, 'Look away, Look away. Don't be looking at the bikes!' You know, I just, I'm itching to get on them again. But it's yeah, it's it's quite hard, that way I suppose.

Claire :

Yeah. I mean, you've got a particularly a unique one in some ways, than people we've spoken to before, because you've had to make the choice to lose it. Which is difficult, because it sort of sat there tempting you in some ways, because you think, 'Oh, could I try it?' But then in other ways, you when you've got to make that decision for for the good of other people, especially, that can be a hard thing, but no less difficult to, to go through personally, it's, you know, still something to be to be grieved. Would you say, like, if you were speaking to somebody else who was new in this decision, or suddenly found themselves not being able to do it again? What would you say to someone like that?

Mark:

Depends, you know, well to me, it was a hobby, it was a love for the bikes, but I would kind of ask them, you know, you have to look at the bigger picture, as I did. I'm not singling people out, but like, young single guys, you know, they don't have a family and they're kind of, something like that happens, and they're kind of like, 'I'll be okay, I got a few stitches, got a few metal bits in my body. I'll jump back on again.' But, yeah, if it happened to someone else I knew, and it stopped them riding. Yeah, I would just tell them'look at the bigger picture, do you have to do this?' you know, I know you have a love for it and all but just look at your whole life in a just in like a map and see, is it worth getting back on, you know, is it gonna affect other people, and I just had to kind of look at it from a different perspective, my family's perspective and the kids perspective,

Chris:

We touched on this earlier that in your family circumstance, you didn't necessarily have the loving support as a motorcyclist. Whereas when I rode bikes Claire would often say in conversations to people that, you know, 'if something were to happen to Chris while he's doing it, then I would know that he was doing something he loved at the time' so that you know, that would bring her comfort. I think, in those words.

Claire :

I think I said the same thing to my parents when they used to worry about us, I was like, 'Look, if we both go while we're on the bike, we died doing something very happy. Don't worry about us. It was all good!' [all laugh] They didn't take much comfort from that.

Mark:

No

Chris:

But it was it was releasing for me to know that, you know, I could be out with with the support of my wife. How much of your decision to stop was was just you selfishly, this is my decision?

Mark:

As a percentage?! [laughs]

Chris:

Yeah go on, as a percentage!

Mark:

I have thought about this. I would say probably 70% my wife and kids, 30% me wanting to give it up. I would say I'm doing it more for them than myself. If I was a young single guy, I would have jumped on it back on it, no problem.

Chris:

So are you still clinging too much of your gear? Have you got rid of your clothing, helmets, have you sold your two bikes?

Mark:

Yeah, all I have left is two paddock stands, a pair of gloves and a helmet. I have said to my wife you know 'maybe when the kids get a bit older...?'

Chris:

They can have one one paddock stand each!

Mark:

Yeah. So yeah, I obviously I had two bikes. So one of the bikes was wrecked. And then the other one, the newer bike I give to a friend to sell for me. So he had sold out on behalf because I was in a wheelchair and I could hardly move, so.

Claire :

Are you keeping any of that stuff, is it sentimental? Or do you feel like you always wanted something in your life that's to do with bikes, even if it's just a glove?

Mark:

I think yeah, I kind of just want to keep it. Maybe one day, maybe one day? I don't know.

Claire :

So do you feel overall when you had to tell people what you've been through and you know, people have injuries and they generally get a lot of sympathy, a lot of empathy. Did you feel that was less in any way because of how it had happened? And because people do have this kind of view of bikes being dangerous?

Mark:

Yeah, different people, it was kind of like I told you so and then, my family were supportive, and they were kinda like, you know, it's a crotch rocket, you know, something bad's gonna happen eventually. Yeah, it was 50/50. You know, people were saying you shouldn't have got on that you're stupid. On and, you know, my family they were very, very supportive. Like, my wife was amazing. You know, I couldn't even get a shower, you know, she had to help me literally she had to dress me, she had to do everything. So, we had two kids, and then we had three, you know?[laughs] So, yeah, it was difficult. That's probably another reason why it took me off the bike, because I had such a hard time I was out of work for about four or five months, about four months. So yeah, it was difficult.

Claire :

It must be hard, because we've had people talk about losses, where they say that people weren't very understanding what they've been through, or they didn't know what to say. Like, if someone's lost a child, I've had quite a few people say, they didn't know what to say, so they avoided me. But you've got the opposite problem in that people feel overly confident in what to say, almost to the point of diminishing what you're going through and saying 'I told you so'. That must be difficult. It must be hard to take at times.

Mark:

Yeah, I kind of look at people saying that they don't really understand it, they don't understand the full ride. And you know, they've never experienced it themselves. They just see road racers and you know, a lot of a lot of road racers die every year. And that's kind of just like a statistic, you know, it becomes a statistic.

Chris:

Coming back to the idea of it being something to grieve the loss of, something to mourn. Not sure what experiences you know, you might have had lots, you might have not had very much about mourning the loss of someone, how do you think what you've felt and experienced with the loss of the motorbiking could compare with the loss of someone.

Mark:

So, yeah, so if you lose someone, obviously, you have a relationship with that person, you know, once they're gone, your life is a lot different. You can't really imagine life without them, I suppose. But with a bike, you know, as a as being a Christian, I will always, always put God first. So my dad always used to say to me, you know, 'it's a hobby, it's, it's a worldly item, so try and not to make it your God', if you know what I mean. So I kind of looked at it like that, you know, it's kind of just a hobby, and I can get over it. And, you know, I suppose you can talk about getting over stuff all you want, but at the end of the day, you're the one with the feelings, you're the ones who's thinking about the loss and how it's affected you so.

Chris:

I think sometimes if we've got something in us that we haven't processed, whether it is a grief of some description, and we've not identified it, acknowledged it, it starts to leak out. Sometimes we can wonder why we reacted to something in a way we did or why something made us feel a bit defensive or emotional, particularly I think when we're just talking about sort of idols if you have something in your life that you realise you idolise and someone starts to poke at it. Because I can imagine for myself if I had a similar crash that ended my my love of motorbiking or my ability to ride and I had this sort of grief within me that I wasn't sharing with many people because they didn't understand that anytime somebody made a comment about you know, 'I told you so' I'd get quite defensive I'd probably find anger or frustration at that person for saying something without giving it much thought because that's me defending 'well actually no there's hurt, there's hurt inside I need to process that', and it takes time to do that and it's you know, this for you is still pretty fresh, really. You probably still feel physical pain at times from your ankle healing you know there's still those reminders there when you move sharply or whatever that or crumbs, yeah. You said there'maybe when the children are older...' there might be an interest there in two wheels.

Mark:

Yeah, I don't I don't think the interest will ever 100% leave me you know, the love for bikes will always be there I think.

Chris:

Is that something that you you feel, yeah, that's okay, that's okay to have that, I don't have to lose that. Do you feel like you've got permission to stay interested in bikes?

Mark:

Yeah. 100% yeah. There's different ways you can do it. You can go to the races, you can watch on TV, you can just go down a motorbike and look at them. But obviously you're never going to get the thrill of riding and again but yeah, I think it's okay to have that still. Obviously the love you know, obviously I'm a big gamer too, so it's kind of shifted to that know.

Claire :

I wonder how easy it will be to, cos I know a lot of people that have got an interest in bikes and even when I was young my dad would you know if we saw a nice bike or a nice car we'd go over to it what round ever look at it. He's like, 'oh wow look at that!' But I feel like it's easier to do that if you've never experienced being on one because you can do it from a distance and know that it's never going to be something you'll ever get on, like you know going to the MotoGP you watch them go past you you're like 'That's amazing!' But most people aren't on them or don't know what it's like to then have a go at that. Do you think that transition will be something you can do quite easily or do you think it will be difficult being that close to them and then not being able to feel that again?

Mark:

Yeah, I think it'd be very difficult. Because as I said, over the summer, you see them drive past you down the back roads and stuff, and you're just kind of thinking, 'Oh, I want to do it again so badly'. But it's it is definitely hard. You just kind of try to focus on something else, sort of thing[laughs].

Claire :

Yeah, you know, it's difficult. I don't want people to think we're trying to encourage you to get back on a bike.

Mark:

Yeah, no, no, no.

Claire :

But there is that kind of tension that you have to feel between, you know, 'how am I going to deal with this?' And it might be that if it is that difficult, again, it's something you revisit, and we've got things like that in our life, we revisit constantly and think'this is really hard. I need to just assess this and maybe just sit with it for a while and feel a bit rubbish about it. And then I'll pick myself up and move on again'. But I think even acknowledging that it's hard, it just helps you as you're going forwards. Have you ever kind of asked the question, with the accident and everything that happened, have you ever dealt much with the 'why' question? Why me? Why did that happen?

Mark:

Yeah, I have. It kind goes over in my head quite a lot, thinking, before I was going to see my mother and father that day, I was gonna cut the hedge, so I was like, 'wow, I could have went and cut the hedge, and I would have missed the whole thing, you know what I mean? So stupid things are gonna pop into your head, I suppose. But I'm not really someone that 'why me?' 'why that?' I just kind of take life as it comes, you know, I just take life as it happens. I don't really go around regretting things. I just, I do them. If it works out, it works out. If it doesn't, that doesn't. I'm kind of a laid back person. I kind of just it happened, it happened. I'm not going to you know, 'oh why didn't I do this better?' you know, I kind of thought at the time and stuff. But no, I'm, maybe I'm too laid back for that? I don't know. But, yeah.

Chris:

If you were to say to a friend, or a sort of distant family member, if they said 'how you doing?' And you would say,'oh, yeah, I'm up and down. I'm struggling a bit. Sort of grieving the loss of my motorbikes'. Do you feel like that's something that you could say with confidence? Or would you feel embarrassed about offering something like that?

Mark:

Yeah. Probably more on the embarrassed side, because, you know, it's a man made thing, they don't get the real thrill of it, especially talking to someone who has no idea about bikes, you know, they could just say, 'Oh, you've lost it, brush it on, go ahead, you know, carry on with your life'. And then you're sitting there like,'Yeah, but it affects me', but it would be hard to sort of, say to someone about it. Yeah, I think I would find it hard. Yeah.

Chris:

Have any good things come out of just strictly out of this? Have you identified any good things that have come out of this situation?

Mark:

Yeah. I spend, like, the weekends I was off, it was usually out with the guys on the bikes. So now I'm a lot more time with the family, so that is, that's a big positive. I have, obviously, I have a car and I so I can take the kids with me, obviously, because they're so young, they wouldn't get on a bike anyway, but I have the car now. And I feel more I can do stuff with the kids now. And it's just, it has helped me in different ways. And like, bikes are an expensive hobby, you know, especially with fuel prices what they are at the minute. And when I had the bike, I was always looking for the next 'ah what bike can get now? you know, 'I'm saving up for another bike, I'm doing this, doing that'. So it's kind of put my mind at rest that way, that I'm not thinking, you know, what's the next hit? What's the next like bike I'm gonna get?' sort of thing. So yeah, it's helped me that way. I don't have to think about that anymore. Because I was always as I say, was kind of addicted to looking at bikes on the internet, looking up specs, you know, things about them and stuff. And that's kind of all came the rest

Chris:

Reached the last question. What's your Herman?

Mark:

My Herman is look at the bigger picture, bad things happen in life, you just got to take the pros and cons out of it, and yeah, look at the bigger picture, that's kind of my motto.

Chris:

And how many times you have to remind yourself of that?

Mark:

During the summer when I see the bikes! [laughs]

Claire :

A healthy reminder for us that looking at the bigger picture can help us see other factors that need considering and other people in our lives and how things impact them too. It's very easy in our grief and loss to become completely introspective, which has its place but ultimately can give us a very narrow view of our situation. Thanks Mark for letting us explore the loss of your bikes and for being so honest about the challenges this loss can raise when talking to others about it.

Chris:

If you're new to The Silent Why you can find out more about who we are, and why we do what we do, on the website www.thesilentwhy.com or search for The Silent Why Pod on social media. Now there are so many great bike related quotes we

Claire :

This podcast is something I work on full time, could have used at the end of this episode such as 'Life is and probably the most enjoyable use of my time I've ever had. Even though I do miss a paid job from time to time. And there are a few wonderful people who support me on Buy Me a Coffee.com to make this possible. If you'd like to join them that not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning how would make my day just head over to www.buymeacoffee.com/thesilentwhy to make a small, big, one off, to ride in the rain.' or regular donation. Or this from the late MotoGP race of Marco Simoncelli;'You live more for five minutes going fast on a bike than other people do all their life'.

Chris:

Instead we'll finish with this quote from Neil Peart;

Claire :

'When I'm riding my motorcycle, I'm glad to be alive. When I stop riding my motorcycle, I'm glad to be alive.'

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